Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

Legend
Legend

I work with the design of boats, and I'm looking for some advice. First off, I'm using ST4, that's what I've been given to work with, and upgrading to ST7 isn't an option.

 

I'd like to show brake lines from the rear of the boat side up into the front curve of the boat side. On top of that, I'd like these brake lines to taper, from maybe 10 degrees at the back of the boat, to nothing at the front of the boat. The screen shot is showing a boat side, and a top view to see the radius at the front.

 

What are my choices to accomplish this in a model? I have used lofted flanges to do parts that stay in one plane. The current part uses flanges and contour flanges to create what I have. The part is driven off multiple sketches that change this part as I change the desired size of my boat assembly.

 

My local SE agent says it can't be done, unless I upgrade to ST7. I find it hard to believe that nobody has figured it out before ST7. I'm no expert by any means, and the more I come to this forum, the more I realize that there's some pretty sharp users out there that are leaps and bounds above my abilities. Please share your experiences, I always enjoy learning from anyone that has the answers!

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24 REPLIES

Re: Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

MLombard
Retired

What is it that you need to wind up with? Do you want to have a 100% flattenable sheet metal boat panel? How is it manufactured? Are you doing this on a brake press with individual bends, or is it more of a forming operation? Do you have an image of what you want to wind up with (like a finished boat/panel)?

 

If you don't need to have it flattenable with sheet metal, it's "easy" with sweeps. Of course getting the curves established can be tricky, depending on what kind of data you start out with.

 

Getting things to taper to nothing is typically not a sheet metal type function. If you're doing this in fiberglass, I'd do this all with bluesurfs. Maybe with a little more info we can get you going in a productive direction.

Retired Community Manager for Solid Edge. This account is no longer active.

Re: Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

Legend
Legend
This is Sheetmetal, and I want to utilize the tilt on the press brake to achieve each brake line. I may not get to zero degrees at one end, maybe only one or two degrees. It's done in the industry by many companies, but I don't have a photo to share right now. 


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ST8 MP9
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Re: Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

Esteemed Contributor
Esteemed Contributor

Hi there,

 

What you're looking to do is outside of the bounds of the "normal" straight brake ethos that Solid Edge sheet metal based upon.

Yes it is an achievable real life cheat [tilt] used in industry, but not very common in my experience.....moreover, is generally the practice to add more brake lines to achive the same result. [such as in a cone]

 

If you could share a part model of the form you want to end up with, I'm sure there will be a workable solution within sheet metal.

Sean Cresswell
Design Manager Streetscape Limited
Solid Edge ST10 [MP1] Classic [x2 seats]
Windows 10

Re: Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

Legend
Legend
This boat is in our shop, and I think you might get a better idea what I'm after. I realize that not everyone has this sort of experience on the shop floor, and it's not something most people would ever need. But in this industry, you'd be surprised how often this is done, even if only just a rib type die set. My hope is someone out there has a trick up their sleeve to model this within the limits of solid edge, and ST4 to boot.

http://brysonsairboattours.com/gallery2.html# 


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ST8 MP9
Go FAST, or go home.

Re: Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

Legend
Legend

We are having a discussion this week about possibly moving up to ST7. Will this open the way for me to model what I've asked for?

 

Are the photos in the link giving a clearer idea what I'm trying to model for production to duplicate?

ST8 MP9
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Re: Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

Esteemed Contributor
Esteemed Contributor

BoatTech wrote:

We are having a discussion this week about possibly moving up to ST7. Will this open the way for me to model what I've asked for?

 

Are the photos in the link giving a clearer idea what I'm trying to model for production to duplicate?


 

Great news, if that happens....the move to ST7 will be a pretty decent leap from ST4.

[just remember it's ONLY avilable in 64bit.....so system software & hardware upgrades need to be factored in]

 

I see the sides of the boat hull in the photo's but still unsure as to the process in which you want to make them. Do you construct these from a single sheet? and/or, are there welds at the top of each chine??

 

This video shows your hull shape a bit better......

Sean Cresswell
Design Manager Streetscape Limited
Solid Edge ST10 [MP1] Classic [x2 seats]
Windows 10

Re: Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

Legend
Legend

I'm not holding my breath on the ST7, but we will see what comes from the discussion with our customers. If I understand correctly, with ST7 I could make my side panels a part file, and then convert to sheetmetal. As long as I can see/show the final product, I can add necessary marks in the panel for the brake operators to locate the forming.

 

We, and I see nothing different with others in the industry, make the side panels from one piece, unless it's too long (over 20') and then I add extra material needed to the front of the boat side panel. I've been "cheating" with this approach. to make things easier to mate up. I'll make my side out of one piece, then cut it in the flat pattern and save each side of the cut as 2 parts that can be manufactured and put together during welding/assembly.

 

I have a slew of sketches that make my bottom and sides update with formulas as I change boat sizes, in relation to each other. I dread the idea of having to figure that all out again if I make my parts in a different manner. But, it's still fun tackling something like that and making it work.

ST8 MP9
Go FAST, or go home.

Re: Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

Legend
Legend

One more question before I end the day: Is ST7 going to allow me to do what I need to do, or is this just flat out beyond the nature of Solid Edge and it's sheetmetal environment? I would like to have some solid proof if I'm going to make this stand when we have the discussion late this week.

ST8 MP9
Go FAST, or go home.

Re: Sheetmetal Experts: brake lines on a curve

Esteemed Contributor
Esteemed Contributor

BoatTech wrote:

One more question before I end the day: Is ST7 going to allow me to do what I need to do, or is this just flat out beyond the nature of Solid Edge and it's sheetmetal environment? I would like to have some solid proof if I'm going to make this stand when we have the discussion late this week.


 

I hear you.....well, at the very least, it won't be a backward step. All you have done will still function as expected. You will just have a raft of new tools to play with & learn. They can only add to [or indeed improve] your methods currently employed, right?

 

It's still a little difficult to offer potential modelling solutions without a reference model to go from. As I'm assuming it has compound curvature in the finished form.

Sean Cresswell
Design Manager Streetscape Limited
Solid Edge ST10 [MP1] Classic [x2 seats]
Windows 10